By Tseba Tashi Rinchen [5/2/2010]
Inland China has many Tibetan classes, students in Tibetan areas graduating from primary school can begin to take entrance exams for inland Tibetan classes, after finishing junior high school they can take exams for senior high school or secondary technical school (Ch. zhongzhuan), after finishing senior high school they can take exams for college, after finishing secondary technical school they return directly to Tibet to work. Tibetan students who study in Tibetan inland classes, must return to Tibet to work, because their entire school tuition and living expenses are covered by the state.
From 1998-2000 I was a teacher for two years at the Shanghai Administration Management School. Shanghai has two schools that have Tibetan classes, this is one of them. When I was told I was arranged to be the head teacher of a Tibetan class, my state of mind was very fresh and excited, my head was full of “snowland, khatak, Potala Palace”, these kinds of words. The principal and I brought along several Tibetan students in senior grades to the train station to pick up the new students of my class, these senior grade students were already completely adjusted to life in Shanghai, they were very united, very capable and experienced, barely heeding my concerns, they brought their fellow sisters and brothers back to school, and took perfect care of them. And my own Tibetan students, would also in a short several years, undergo a transformation like that.
When I first started to engage with my Tibetan students, the impact was still very great. They were junior high school students who had already studied for three years in the inland, but there were some students who were still unusually nervous and timid, you spoke to them gently, and it was as if they had been startled, they would even produce an unnaturally shrill laugh. I thought this must be the reaction of people who had lived a long time in a simple and closed-off environment, upon entering an unfamiliar and bustling city. The weather was still hot, and as soon as they sweated, the bodies of Tibetan students would emit a strong peculiar odor, which Han Chinese students and teachers could barely stand, yet if you showed your aversion, it would have offended them greatly. To get new students into the habit of taking baths regularly, was an important but difficult task. Girls generally adapted very quickly, boys would take a little longer.
In all fairness, our ethnic policies are doing many things. I saw on the internet it said the Chinese Communist Party’s ethnic policies were the best in China’s history, this I didn’t know. According to what I have seen, the state bore all of the tuition, living expenses, and medical expenses for Tibetan students, all the daily necessities and school supplies were allocated by the school, and there were also large scholarships provided by two enterprises. Each year over Tibetan new year, we specially gave them money to buy decorations and snacks. Each year there were opportunities such as tours, watching movies, watching performances, and sightseeing. We actually treated them without any kind of ideological control, like how I was the head teacher of a class, I didn’t even say a word about major principles, the weekly class meeting lessons, were all earnestly telling them not to smoke and not to date. However, I want to discuss some of the issues I observed.
From looking at my encounters with Tibetan students, I think the gap between rich and poor in Tibetan areas is extremely great. Tibet is a place where the natural environment is very harsh, if ordinary farmers and nomads rely on self production, income is extremely low, making a living is very difficult. However, the state invests enormous amounts in Tibet, so as long as you aren’t a farmer or nomad, and you are an employed person, it doesn’t matter if you’re a work unit cadre, or an ordinary factory worker, income is very high. I’ve seen my students’ records, which has documents on their household situation. It was 1998 at the time, according to one of my students, his parents were just ordinary workers in a factory, and earned as much as six thousand RMB per month. Yet in Shanghai at that time a normal salary was one to two thousand RMB. The gap between rich and poor created by this is huge. The students in my class, if they were from farmer or nomad households, except for a living subsidy given by the state, barely had any money to spend, however those whose parents were employed, spent money extravagantly, noticeably exceeding the average Shanghai student. The student who was the heaviest spender in my class, a student who gave me the most headaches, the father was said to be the principal of the Tibet Communist Party School. Later I read a report that said the central government had become aware of this problem, and had increased subsidies for farmers and nomads, however China is vast, to depend on subsidies forever is to create inequalities. My colleague said he went to Qinghai representing the Ministry of Education last year, because China is a typical case of the child who cries gets the milk, the state invested a lot in Tibet and Xinjiang, but neglected Qinghai, and Qinghai’s hardships are great. Because in Qinghai, Gansu, Sichuan, and other provinces, Tibetans reside mixed together with other ethnic groups, the state cannot provide subsidies just for Tibetans; because of this Tibetans living outside of the Tibet Autonomous Region receive very little benefits. In the news reports you read, incidents happen more frequently in Qinghai, Sichuan, and other places, but not within the Tibet Autonomous Region.
A separate problem this has triggered is official corruption, in particular corruption of Tibetan officials. A senior grade girl who established a personal friendship with me told me, she was a daughter of nomads, they knew to take examinations for inland Tibetan classes was to change their fate of opportunities, because of this they made desperate efforts. But if one prefecture accepted ten students, you basically had to test three places ahead to have a chance, because the rest of the quota would all be taken by the people who had connections. Within the administrative system in the Tibet Autonomous Region, the Communist Party depends on the ranks of Tibetan cadres they’ve cultivated themselves to carry out supervision. Because they must depend heavily on them, and because of the sensitivities of different ethnic groups communicating, Tibetan cadres are treated more leniently compared to other areas, and this noticeably creates more serious corruption. And similarly, official corruption will bring even more serious and complicated consequences to ethnic areas. Among my Tibetan students, some didn’t care at all about studying, they had nothing to fear, because their parents or relatives were cadres. And there were some extremely hardworking farmer and nomad children, but knew that no matter how outstanding their efforts, in the future there still wouldn’t be any great prospects. It’s not like in a big city like Shanghai, that provides all kinds of employment opportunities, the average person relying on their own professional skills can gain a proper place, Tibet is a place that is highly dependent on the central government, students looking for work all have to rely on job allocations, this then creates a hotbed of corruption. That Tibetan girl who I was fond of, earned the top score on tests every year, yet after graduating she went to a remote area to be an accountant in a small hotel; in addition there was a class monitor of outstanding behavior, who went to the countryside, that place didn’t even have electricity, he wrote a letter mocking himself saying he held candlelight vigils everyday. But nowhere near her classmates, was the comfortable and high-salaried civil servant. The social injustices I observed from the students, are refracted and expanded upon each aspect of the entire region, which makes me consider the Tibet Autonomous Region as an undercurrent surging, a looming crisis. Official corruption and social injustice, are common occurrences in all of China, but in ethnic autonomous regions, contradictions intensify very easily.
Whether or not one can get a good job results in lives and destinies as different as heaven and earth, some students who were originally farmer and nomad children, behaved with a particularly fervent “striving for advancement”. I had just finished announcing the class cadre composition list, and there were students who stayed behind and said to me directly, he wanted to be the class monitor, he said that he could take all the work upon himself, I didn’t need to worry about anything, he just wanted to be class monitor. Yet another student told me as well, he could do any amount of work, he also wanted to be class monitor. Later I realized, those who treated teachers ambivalently, indifferently were all the children of cadres, and had already entered into the ranks of the state. However, those acting with active affirmation were the children of farmers and nomads, in order to squeeze into the ranks of the state. My class monitor and mission branch secretary practically quarreled for two years, during which one went so far as to send the auntie overseeing the dormitories to me to attack the other in a small report. My class monitor was extremely capable, he could handle any situation, I practically couldn’t intervene. I tried to use democracy in the class, and let them vote for class cadres, even such a simple task could create complicated factional struggles within the class. When I realized my class monitor reported everything including my small report, I couldn’t help but inwardly feel angry at heart. Right at this time, he picked up an IC card (a pre-paid card) on the sports field, he knew very well that this belonged to another Tibetan student (the school issued special IC cards to Tibetan students, a set amount of money was deposited into it each month, the students could use them in the cafeteria or campus stores), yet he went to a store and spent it all at once. However, since there were only two or three hundred Tibetan students, the staff of the little store knew practically each student. For someone who normally doesn’t waste money like this, to suddenly spend so much money at once, definitely would have left a deep impression. As soon as the student who lost the card asked at the small store, the matter was exposed at once. If this kind of situation was reported to the school, his class monitor status would have been immediately stripped. Reportedly, my class monitor kneeled down and begged the other person, saying this was a Tibetan students’ scandal, don’t let the Han Chinese teachers know about it, the other person let him off, but his own classmates wouldn’t let him get away with it, and told me. I called my class monitor to the office, and asked him about this incident, he started off by not admitting it, and then would not speak. I saw the emotional pressure on him was too much, and so chatted about other things with him, asking him about his situation at home. He kept his mouth drawn in a smile, saying his “Aba” and “Ama” back home, farming was so difficult, after they got a little older they wouldn’t be able to work anymore, something happened to one of his older brothers, another older brother doing lumber work, was washed into a river and drowned. A 1.8 meter tall boy, face large and dark, when he left home, he promised his Ama he would behave well, he promised to emancipate himself. He said, most other students’ families would send a little pocket money to spend, but his family hadn’t sent him a dime, watching his classmates buying this and that, he felt very envious, when he picked up the [IC] card…… I think there is no way I can ever forget that face with the smile drawn on it, with big, big tears falling down.
An unequal social environment, will give the human psyche a certain degree of distortion. Many Tibetan student cadres, are better than their Han Chinese counterparts at speaking the bureaucratic lingo, regarding the unhealthy bureaucratic culture of the Han Chinese, the blue that comes out of the indigo plant is bluer than the plant itself (the pupil surpasses the master). I am often surprised that after fifty years the Dalai Lama still has appeal to the Tibetan people, the strength of religion is no doubt great, but perhaps it is related to the lack of credibility of government officials.
Another issue I have found, is the gulf between Han Chinese and Tibetan ethnicities. In school, it is rather rare to see individual friendships between Han Chinese and Tibetan students. Because the state has policies for the protection of minorities, if a dispute arose, it would certainly be in favor of the ethnic minority. The school and teachers repeatedly advise the Han Chinese students, be careful not to incite ethnic conflicts. This kind of careful and cautious mentality, then becomes avoiding contact when possible, as much as possible, for the sake of avoiding trouble. Lacking communication between individuals, observing one group, often one would just see a few very admirable or very terrible members. I saw a lot of online discussions, saying there were Tibetan students who got drunk, and chased Han Chinese students with knives. These kinds of incidents had also occurred at our school, we also had a Tibetan student who got drunk, had a drunken rage in the town, smashing glass and streetlights, the entire town held its breath, listening to him breaking glass. But these are all extremely rare, if you don’t have contact with this group, you would only see this out of line person, if you have contact with the group, then you would realize that the majority of them are really great. Being empathetic, I have seen exclusively uncivilized phenomena happening all the time among Han Chinese, yet that cannot represent all Han Chinese people.
I really love my Tibetan students, but my initial romantic way of thinking gradually disappeared, I think that, people under the heavens are all the same, if there are some special characteristics, it’s very likely to be imprints from the environment. Most would think that Tibetan people are unsophisticated and warm-hearted, unmoved by material things. But I think it was probably created by a single long-term, closed environment. In my observations, my Tibetan students adapted to Shanghai very quickly. From being anxious and shy, they quickly became fashionable and self-confident, in a few short months, if they had enough financial ability, they very quickly became no different from the Shanghai boys and girls. They didn’t become Sinified, but rather became urbanized, modernized, this was by no means the intention of the government.
I don’t believe that the Tibet fifty years ago was a paradise, because my student showed me photos of her family from the 1950s, and I was startled by what I saw, the people in it were so dark and thin, bearing a kind of dull expression, as if carved from wood. She also told me that before liberation people only lived to about thirty years old. There wasn’t even any kind of marital system, her two younger sisters, seemed to be from a different father. Perhaps there are tourists who like to see primitive forms of cultures, but speaking for the people living in the midst of it, they have the right to live even happier lives, rather than turning their lives into fossils for others to look at. However, something else I want to remind my Han Chinese fellows is, don’t assume another person’s thinking is too simple. You consider that you liberated them from a dark and horrible feudal serf system, and they ought to be forever grateful. You think that since you’ve spent so much money, they should express a manner that is very happy and reciprocate the care they have received. Yes, these things are by no means untrue. However, every person, each has his dignity, each has his own independent way of thinking. For an ethnic group, it is even more so.
One theme that the vice-principal of the school in charge of Tibetan student work never forgot when holding big meetings was contrasting the past miseries with present happiness of Tibetan students. One time, he said, “You must treasure the conditions for studying and living in Shanghai, last year I sent graduates to Tibet, not to remote places, just the suburbs of Lhasa, the farmers in the field were eating…” He hadn’t finished speaking yet, when senior grade students began to create a disturbance and whistle, the sound drowning him out. Teachers were also remarking amongst themselves that Tibetan students were no longer the same as before, graduating classes once had the opportunity to visit a large-scale enterprise, like Bao Steel or something, in the past when Tibetan students were asked “Do you want to go there?”, they were all very excited, however now if you ask them, they are very indifferent, and say they aren’t interested. There was a Tibetan student who privately told me very directly: “You all just want to tell us, how advanced you all are, and how backwards we are; you’ve given us so much, we depend on you for everything.” Another time, I had my class monitor come to my office to pick up the class schedule, after looking it over he said: “Teacher, I want to add a word.” I was really astonished, I didn’t know where the mistake was. He took up a pen, and added the word “Chinese” in front of “Language”, turning it into “Chinese Language”. I said: “Isn’t this the same?” He said to me very seriously: “There is also Tibetan language, we must write clearly which language it is.” However, Tibetan language was not taught in the school, not that the school did not attach importance to it. Reportedly in the past they even invited a Tibetan teacher to teach Tibetan language and literature, but after living there for a year, he left because of being too lonely. From this little incident I felt the tenacity that Tibetan students have for their own ethnicity’s language and culture.
I often think, this generation of young people, whether they are Han Chinese, or Tibetan, are totally different than those in the past. They have received comprehensive and good educations, plus they are in an age of information, they are all modern people. However, the mark of ethnicity is still deep in the blood. Han Chinese shouldn’t think so simply about ethnic minorities as they have in the past, namely I’ve invested a lot of money in you, taken care of everything for you, you should know right from wrong, honesty, peace, and security. We are the same kind of people, we are all in a rapidly changing generation, we all endure the pressures and impacts of industrial civilization and urban living, between passing on traditions and becoming a modern citizen we all have confusion and ignorance. We have to love one another, use our hearts to communicate, and together start a new life.
The most difficult thing for me to forget was after I was admitted as a graduate student and had to leave the school, my Tibetan students sent me off. That was in 2000 during the hottest time of the summer, they said they had to drink, but the school rules prohibited drinking. So I went to their dormitory, within the narrow rooms bunk beds filled up most of the space. In the 37-38 degree heat, thirty something people were crowded in, each person came up and presented me with a khatak, holding their wine glasses they sang a drinking song. Khataks were piled on top of me, and sweat, and tears, there was no air circulating through, there are only a few times in life one can have this kind of carefree and strong emotion!
I love my Tibetan students, I consider Han Chinese to be like the eldest brother in a big family, who must take good care of his younger brothers and sisters. What the eldest brother must do now, I think is not to make this or that arrangement, but to quietly listen to the heartfelt thoughts of his younger brothers and sisters, after all, as the eldest brother matures, the younger brothers and sisters are also growing up, nothing stays the same as the past.
Reposted from an online discussion forum
I originally thought that only people like myself who studied Tibetan language, by birth, or students graduating from a nationalities college could regard ethnic culture with a strong identification and pride. After working I came to know a few compatriots who had very poor Tibetan language and had continuously studied in the inland, and was bowled over by their ethnic pride. Once, I participated in a 2-on-2 basketball competition at Tibet University organized by Motorola, my teammate was a Han Chinese person. At the time there was an inland-schooled Tibet University student who I had just met not five minutes before who asked me “Don’t you have a Tibetan teammate?” a question that left me speechless. I considered the most important issue between Han Chinese and Tibetans was the vast differences in culture and ideology, as a result of local authorities’ strict control and the information channels being blocked, 95% of inland people think that most of us Tibetans are opposed to the Dalai Lama, and are very satisfied with the status quo. After reading this article, my feeling is quite deep, this teacher is at least a person who is willing to listen, not like some self-righteous people who think “Chinese Empire number one under the heavens”, “thousands of countries submit themselves to the rule of the king, thousands of governments send congratulatory messages to the king”. Yet, when can there be a window in this tall and lofty “Berlin Wall” that lies between the hearts of Tsanpo’s ancestors and the successors of the Dragon?
[ 2010/3/11 20:46:00 | By: shahsa]
Being able to live on one land, isn’t this fate? Is it necessary to quarrel back and forth like this? What we need to confront is how to surpass other nations, not how to hurt our own family, I also want to say to each Han compatriot, we are not parasites, we are also not an ungrateful ethnicity, watching China develop each day I am endlessly excited, in this peaceful era why can’t we be agreeable?
[ 2010/3/8 22:41:00 | By: Honestly Speaking]
The following is quoted from Han person posted on 2010/3/7 12:40:00
Han Chinese brothers – leaders have racked their brains, the nation has spent tremendous human and financial resources on Tibet, nothing more than wanting to elevate the material living standards of Tibetan comrades a little, not even a little
What is wrong. You guys should know when you call Tibetan people “parasites” and other ugly sounding names here, you are fundamentally going against the interests of the state and the people, traitorous!
I hope all ethnic brothers calmly have a dialogue, don’t speak to hurt people.
Tibet is a political issue not an economic issue. Have you not seen Peng Bod pa’s post? Tibetans always bring up the monasteries destroyed by the Cultural Revolution, this and that. Tibetans never bring up the monasteries smashed by Tibetan Red Guards and often quote unlimited, exaggerated figures, 3000 monasteries 6000 monasteries were destroyed. As if they were all non-Tibetans (Han Chinese) who did it, and because of this hold a grudge. Tibetans always cast the source of every contradiction on non-Tibetans (Han Chinese). Tibetans don’t have any faults. Tibetans are completely perfect. Non-Tibetans (Han Chinese) are evil. Now we should call forward all the Tibetan Red Guards of that time, thoroughly investigate affairs during the Cultural Revolution. Whoever did it will bear the responsibility. You can’t unfairly treat non-Tibetan people. It is still justice for all the world’s people.
[ 2010/3/4 16:13:00 | By: Beng Bod pa]
In several thousand years of history, we have used wise minds, dexterous hands and diligent labor, to create so much world cultural heritage and glorious architecture, just think overnight in the 1960s, a catastrophe imposed on us, that didn’t allow us to leave behind much possessions and imprints of our ancestors. I just don’t understand why on the blogs Han people must always pour salt on our wounds.
[ 2010/2/9 12:18:00 | By: Khampa Tibetan Mastiff ]
User Da Ming has a lot of content, so I’ll focus on a few to comment on.
1. Extra points on college entrance exams: Education in Tibetan areas is extremely backwards to begin with, on top of that Chinese language originally is not our mother tongue language, learning is very difficult, college examination admissions standards for Tibetans is indeed lower than that for Han Chinese, now they are gradually reducing this score, currently according to my understanding extra points for college entrance exams only add 20 points. (Note: Currently according to China’s development, education in Tibetan areas is lagging the furthest behind.)
2. Grain and oil subsidies: If you are referring to the the planned economy period when Tibetans studying in college actually had subsidies, now it has become a market economy, my nephew and niece going to school in Beijing and Chongqing, I carefully asked and they have no subsidies whatsoever.
3. Medical treatment: in old age all citizens enjoy free medical care, now every year we hand over about 100 RMB in medical insurance fees, we can be reimbursed for 70-80% of major illnesses, minor illnesses are entirely out of pocket. Another thing: inland medical care conditions are far better than in Tibetan areas, otherwise why would so many patients run from Tibetan areas to Chengdu, Beijing, and other places every year to seek medical treatment. (Note: Currently according to China’s development, health care in Tibetan areas is lagging the furthest behind.)
4. Net users say, if you look at your original words: “since 1980, the central government has implemented policies that restrain Han Chinese people and favor Tibetan people in the areas of administration, economy, culture, health, education, birth control, society, and law. I say no wonder! No wonder western regions are so rich, eastern regions are so backward!! Ha ha ha ha….”
I provide another set of data below, you can see from the below data, Tibet’s poverty ratio is up to 88%, Tibet’s population is 2,740,000, the poverty-stricken population is 2,406,000, it has the highest ratio of poverty-stricken people in the entire country.
China’s provinces and cities are ranked by number of poverty-stricken population. See what rank your hometown is?
I saw a “Ranking of China’s provinces and cities by poverty-stricken population” online, population units should be based on 10,000,000. From the list, Shanghai actually doesn’t have a single poor person. It is really astonishing! Shanghai classmates come speak up, has Shanghai really gotten so rich that it doesn’t have a single poverty-stricken person?
Below is the ranking!
Province Poverty-stricken population Total population Ratio
31 Henan 3250 9717 33%
30 Sichuan 3198 8725 37%
29 Hebei 2086 6808 31%
28Yunnan 1897 4415 43%
27Guizhou 1739 3904 45%
26 Gansu 1078 2619 41%
25 Anhui 983.3 6461 15%
24 Chongqing 974.8 2771 35%
23 Shanxi 968.6 3705 26%
22 Shanxi 926.9 3335 28%
21 Helongjiang 879.5 3816.8 23%
20 Hubei 868.9 6016 14%
19 Shandong 786.2 9180 9%
18 Jiangxi 745.4 4283 17%
17 Hunan 730.7 6698 11%
16 Guangxi 710.8 4889 15%
15 Liaoning 690.9 4217 16%
14 Jiangsu 630.5 7432. 5 8%
13 Jilin 602.3 2708.5 22%
12 Inner Mongolia 590.1 2384 25%
11Xinjiang 586.8 1963 30%
10 Fujian 549.8 3511 16%
9 Guangdong 490.9 8304 6%
8 Ningxia 280.9 588 48%
7 Qinghai 269.8 539 50%
6 Tibet 240.6 274 88%
5 Hainan 232.3 818 28%
4 Zhejiang 190.5 4719 4%
3 Tianjin 187.4 932.55 20%
2 Beijing 53.6 1162.9 5%
1 Shanghai 0 1352 0%
[ 2010/2/9 0:16:00 | By: since ]
The following is quoted from Da Ming posted on 2010/2/8 13:40:00:
Tibetans have lived on the snowy plateau for thousands of years, not because some other ethnic group nurtured them.
True, you guys have lived thousands of years, however, in historical books and records, your population, from the beginning of the Qing Dynasty, up until the 1950s, a span of 300 years, surprisingly did not increase much.
300 years ago the Tibetan population was under 2,000,000, after 300 years it was still around 2,000,000. Clearly from the beginning, the development of your Tibetan society was already at a stand still.
Perhaps due to the aid of inland Chinese people, your population within a short time, under 50 years, has increased by more than triple.
Clearly, the feeding and nurturing by inland Chinese people, has nurtured you within 50 years to a population of 4,000,000.
Da Ming brother, don’t separate the inland ethnic groups from the Han ethnic group. Manchu, Mongolian, and other ethnicities down the generations, it’s only on the identification card that notes whatever ethnicity, but in reality it’s possible that Han blood is more than the blood of the ethnic group noted. Like the film actress Xu Qing, I originally thought she was of Tujia ethnicity, but later looked at some materials, ethnicity follows the maternal line, her maternal grandmother, mother was Tujia, how is she different from us Han Chinese? During primary school, a classmate whose ethnic make-up was Mongolian, I only knew when she filled out a form, but her family had lived in a Han Chinese area for generations. As for Manchus, how many are still of pure Manchu blood? Recently someone in Henan claimed to be Manchu. Supposedly the ancestor was Jinshi, the enemy of that Yuefei, generation after generation, would you say Han blood is more or Manchu blood is more? During the Qing it did not change, until the PRC changed the Manchus, a true thirteen points, do you think there is any point to note ethnic make-up on identification cards nowadays? Exploited by those with ulterior motives, our coastal areas here, there is too much mobility of people of each ethnicity and region in the entire country, except for looking at the identification card, you can’t see any differences. Of course when someone wears their hometown clothes you can see the difference, and I’m not even talking about ethnic clothes, we Han Chinese have never worn Han clothes this is narrow-minded, qipao dresses are both modern Han Chinese and also Manchu clothes, but looking at operas performed with ancient costumes, the Han clothes during the Han and Tang dynasties were so beautiful, moreover, were not changed for a thousand years. If it had lasted up until the modern era, it would have been such a beautiful design. However the fact is, it is only a show, in the opera I suspect they just use an imitation of Han clothing. Looking at the Japanese kimono that is derived from Tang dynasty clothing, isn’t it beautiful. As for the Tibetan areas you are discussing now, what we want to say to you is, each of us provinces sometimes also form cliques on China’s internet, so don’t take the arguments here for real. In my little knowledge, Ma Bufang was of the Hui ethnicity, since it is all blamed on the Han Chinese, so don’t Han Chinese Han Chinese, in reality the Hui ethnicity was also a real inheritor of Han culture. As for Tibetans, over several thousand years the group it had the greatest exchange and contact with was the Han, as a result of the geographic conditions, for the time being let’s not discuss the relations between geographic conditions and blood stock, our ancient classical Chinese reversed a lot (object placed in front), in school we had to learn that Kham, Gansu, Qinghai, Yunnan, and Sichuan Tibetans lived together with other ethnic groups, in history tribal forms received the rule of the central government, of course high mountains, dangerous roads, poor land, few people, local officials didn’t interfere, allowing a relatively independent culture to develop.
As a result of geographic conditions, coupled with cultural development, in Tibetans’ eyes there are only Han Chinese. In Qinghai Tibetans are a minority, there are also a lot of Han, Hui, and Mongolians, Qaidam is a Mongolian place, the populous areas in the valleys are where Han and Hui live, Tibetans are mainly in Huangnan and Yushu, that Dalai is from close to Xining, but now he’s stirring up Tibetan independence, joking. I didn’t want to join this discussion forum to talk, just to know and inform Da Ming brother, to speak with a brother. Brother could also be getting angry here sometimes because of the Dalai, understanding, understanding
[ 2010/2/8 22:03:00 | By: Da Ming]
Outside of birth control policy, what kind of substantive preferential ethnic minority policies has the government given? Government spending is uneven, this is a reality, however it is not directed at ethnic minorities, and it is also not given to some particular ethnic group, but it is given to the coastal industrial areas
Tibetans enjoy a lot of substantive preferential policies, you Tibetans’ special characteristic is being ungrateful.
Outside of the preferential birth control policy you mentioned, let me give you a few lines in summary:
Extra points on entering school, Tibetans’ college entrance exam admissions standard must be lower than Han Chinese by about 150 points.
Grain and oil subsidies, Tibetan students in school enjoy several times more subsidies than Han Chinese students.
Medical treatment, the national medical subsidy Tibetans enjoy is far greater that the average standard for inland China. In addition, beginning in the 1980s, they have received these subsidies.
Since 1980, the CCP has practiced policies that suppress the Han Chinese and privilege Tibetans in the areas of administration, economy, culture, health, education, birth control, society, and justice.
[ 2010/2/8 20:11:00 | By: Khampa Tibetan Mastiff ]
However in reality, up until now the production value of these things in Tibetan areas is not high. It is far below the assistance provided to Tibetan people by inland people.
This remark is wrong, the value of all the “precious deposits” and the minerals, animal and plant resources possessed by Tibet and Tibetan areas that were transported to inland China over several decades is far greater than whatever the government has given. There is an old saying that says it best: Sheep’s wool only grows out of a sheep’s body, a “mouthpiece” has only ever propagated whatever it was given, while not saying a word what has been taken away from Tibet and Tibetan areas.
But in reality, now there are some Tibetans, who on one hand enjoy all kinds of special preferential policies provided by the money of blood and sweat from inland people, and on the other hand ungratefully hate deeply inland people, particularly Han Chinese people.
Except for being able to have more children, Tibet and Tibetan areas are the same as inland citizens, can’t afford education, can’t afford to be sick, can’t buy a house, and also must bear the pressure of the great gap between rich and poor.
[ 2010/2/8 16:03:00 | By: Unemotional ]
The following is quoted from Da Ming posted on 2010/2/8 14:59:00:
If historical Tibet could only support 10% of its population, then I’m afraid Tibet would have been long gone.
Support is not accurate, though to maintain basic survival like that of animals, indeed current day revenues from economic activity in Tibetan areas should be enough to support Tibetan people now.
But doing this has two unresolved problems:
1) This kind of low level production wastes China’s Tibet’s land and resources. This land and resource belongs to all of the Chinese people, it is state owned.
2) The current standard of living of Tibetan people in China’s Tibetan areas, is not sustainable by that 10% of Tibetan local government finances.
If there weren’t inland Chinese people providing, the taxes of inland Chinese people comprising 90% of the Tibetan local government revenues, Tibetan people’s standard of living would substantially decrease.
Tibetan area health and hygiene, education, transportation and communications, medical care, and all other public facilities and services would be substantially reduced.
So then, Tibetan people’s average life expectancy, infant mortality rate would hugely increase, and levels of education would drastically decrease.
1. If there were no Tibetans (as one of China’s ethnicities) living on the Qinghai Tibetan plateau for several thousand years, can I ask, what qualifications would you have to say this is the territory of all of China?? Did you make this up out of thin air??? If Tibetans are not Chinese people, then with more Han Chinese entering Tibet in the last couple years, do you dare say before liberation that was a separate country? Because there are few Chinese people they ought to be able to forget, while the areas where Tibetans, who are not Chinese, live concentrated like this, on what do you base your claim that it is China’s territory?? The United States has Chinatowns, go say that the US is China’s territory!!! What kind of logic is this!! You’re better off saying baselessly that American land is all of China’s, the entire globe is all of China’s, and see who would agree with you!! To say you are uneducated, your logical abilities weak, you are incapable, this discussion forum has areas for drinking alcohol, but there are no areas for eating distiller’s grains, we don’t listen and we also don’t want to be nurtured, we’re like the brothers the family does not want!!
2. The old Republican government finances could also not support even 10% of the living standards of Han Chinese in Han areas, what kind of excuse is this? The entire world one-thousand years ago could not even provide for 10% of American people’s current living standards!
3. Of the hundreds of millions of Han Chinese people, how many hundreds of millions are rich?? Tibetan people?? On average Tibetan people definitely contribute much more taxes. This little county of ours has one entrepreneur who has over a billion in assets. The Tibetans I have heard about or met who have hundreds of millions in wealth are no less than twenty, but actually all it takes is one to be an example for us to make a great contribution!! The boss who acquired a Hummer is a Tibetan!
4. You guys also want Tibetan areas but don’t want Tibetan areas to enjoy the same results of development from the state as inland China areas, are you humans?? That’s why I say we can sing and praise the local authorities, but we don’t need to thank some particular ethnic “representative” (in reality, he didn’t have this qualification)!!!
[ 2010/2/8 15:47:00 | By: Nyima]
Nurture us??? Do we not have hands and feet??? It’s the biggest joke!!!
In Tibet, I’ve only heard that the salaries of solders are astronomical, followed by that of state cadres, if someone considers this nurturing, please find them and bring them forward. Don’t say irresponsible things to us commoners and peasants! The money of blood and sweat we use comes from the caterpillar fungus and matsutake mushrooms we harvest from the Tibetan mountains, we have never taken your dirty money!!!
[ 2010/2/8 15:41:00 | By: Unemotional]
The following is quoted from Da Ming posted on 2010/2/8 15:07:00:
Did those Tibetan borderland areas not receive the persecution of the central government and inland warlords? Qinghai and Gansu Tibetans were beheaded and massacred by Ma’s rebel army for the central government, Liu Xiang and Liu Wenhui massacred Tibetans in Sichuan, in Tibetans areas of Yunnan, to this day old people calm their grandsons and granddaughters by saying “the white Han have come”, these are all true, you have to consider it comes from some people’s narrow thinking, and now the central government aiding Tibet is its debt.
So then didn’t Tibetans under the leadership of the Dalai expel Han Chinese around 1920? How many Han Chinese civilians and families perished? Do you guys want to repay that?
In the last 49 years, Tibetans are such honest civilians, they were only massacred by nearby warlords?
Obviously it’s not so, why did Ma’s army kill Tibetans? It was that Tibetans overestimated themselves, troops sent from Tibet first attacked Qinghai’s.
So then do you Tibetans want to repay?
1. Excuse me but, at the time the Han Chinese were expelled, how many Han Chinese did Tibet have?
2. Is there a necessary link between the Tibetan local government fighting Qinghai and Ma Bufang’s long-term massacre of people of all ethnicities?? Wasn’t the reason he massacred Han Chinese because the central government attacked him?? Don’t make this traitorous dog a hero for your own self-defense, this kind of historical view of yours is truly a disgrace!! Before Tibet’s local government attacked Qinghai there were plenty of incidents of killing people living on the frontier!! In the final analysis, the Tibetan local government cannot avoid responsibility for the lack of development of the Tibetan population, however the greatest reason for the stagnation of the population in peripheral Tibetan areas was being oppressed by the central government and local warlords, this is undeniable. If you say after the founding of the Republic of China Tibetans killed Han Chinese, then Han Chinese using the state apparatus to kill Tibetans is a vastly greater quantity.
3. If some people can represent an ethnicity, then I can completely say that Xiangxi brigands (in Hunan), Tai Ping army, the Boxers (if you think that a textbook prevails over that non-negotiable), Wang Qingwei, Yuan Shikai are eminent representatives of Han Chinese.
[ 2010/2/8 15:36:00 | By: Tashi Delek]
Tibetans have lived on the snowy plateau for thousands of years, not because some other ethnic group nurtured them. Bump!
[ 2010/2/8 15:18:00 | By: Da Ming ]
it’s merely complaining on Tibetan people’s blogs, what is so unacceptable about it? Han people should have a tolerant heart, because after all we are not an ethnic minority, we cannot experience the particular thoughts and feelings of Tibetan people.
This kind of argument is very problematic. Because you will put yourself in a patronizing position.
To be a person, to be a nation’s citizen, each person, should be equal regardless of ethnicity, that everyone is equal, this is a basic value of modern civilization.
Therefore, to say that to be a Han Chinese person, one should then treat ethnic minorities with tolerance is completely wrong.
Tibetan people complain and insult, slander Han Chinese people, so, to be a Han Chinese person, one should then not accept this, and must fight back.
Your line about us being unable to experience the particular thoughts and feelings of Tibetan people, reciprocally, Tibetan people also cannot experience our particular thoughts and feelings.
Overall, talking about tolerance, understanding, it must be reciprocal, only then is it an attitude of true equality to ethnic minorities.
We should not treat ethnic minorities from a patronizing position, but we also cannot be tolerant and compromise. We must treat them with equality.
[ 2010/2/8 14:40:00 | By: Honestly Speaking ]
PZZ, I just don’t understand why there is always a Han person insisting on arguing about this on the blogs, Tibetans are ethnic minorities, living in a Han-dominated Chinese society of course they will have very strong self-respect. Even if some people are dissatisfied and don’t understand us Han people it also is part of a normal state of mind, these people haven’t broken any laws or rules, it’s merely complaining on Tibetan people’s blogs, what is so unacceptable about it? Han people should have a tolerant heart, because after all we are not an ethnic minority, we cannot experience the particular thoughts and feelings of Tibetan people. In addition the ethnic issue is always pulled into very common affairs, is it oversensitivity, or is it stirring up trouble?
I think, to the contrary, so-called “Han people” and Tibetan brothers should communicate well. Debating is also one way, but it must be objective and rational. “Unemotionally” expressing is very good.